Ever watch the the original Neil Armstrong and crew interview after their moon landing? You go watch and tell me IF these guys really landed on the moon. They look like they just killed grandma and buried her in the back yard. IF I were one of those 3 astronauts and we just came back from the moon it would be like winning the Super Bowl and kissing Raquel Welch ….1.

2. 911 3 buildings 2 planes controlled demolition

Where are the jet engines ?

Inside job just saying

Dr woods has some very intriguing ideas on 911

And people still wear mask?

And the lies just get being told while people clean their houses and are too busy trying to

Do routines to pay attention.

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Yes, the three of them were strangely glum, and unforthcoming, about that "giant step for mankind." The footage is included in a number of good videos on the subject.

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Xactly and they could not even agree what it looked like. I had doubts about the moon

Landing but that interview sealed my suspicions.

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Astronaut 1: It was round, with a yellow hue and a hint of hop flavours.

Astronaut 2: It was flat, and smelled like the old Boston Gardens with granular sand and pixie dust everywhere. And unicorns. Lotsa unicorns. It was divine.

Astronaut 3: It looked like a movie set.

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Very funny yeah it wasn’t cheese either.

Now I am not exactly certain what the f goes

On with the 🌙

But watching those guys looked like their

Dads forced them to do a talent show

And I guess that why they hire actors now.

One giant step for mankind was just another staged lie. They actually had no

Sound of the rocket thrusters landing on

The moon and they even had cell phone

Coverage there ???

1967 I was 12 I believed it then

I also believed in Santa Claus

Easter bunny

Tooth fairy

Tell me there are still unicorns

And that the Red Sox broke the Curse

And Joe Namath predicted a win

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Something no one ever talks about is the stars on the Hollywood Walk of Fame. To get one, you have to be a member of the SAG AFTRA, meaning you have to be an actor.

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Me TOO!!! I questioned everything ....at 1967 I thought it was real....but the bouncing was odd...then I watched their interview. I know when someone is lying. They were lying...then you start to question NASA then you start investigating and gathering...then well people like Phillip are brainwashed...i was too...but water never curves unless a river over rocks ....another thing is there is no noise of the landing thrusters they are conducting a conversation during that time...so IF they lied about this then considering what else is a lie JFK, 911, Too Big too fail, "pandemic" savior in vaxxines. etc.

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Any links or titles? Thank you!

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i worked in a shop and we made engine mounts and yokes for some GE Engines. gotta say one of those would survive most anything, 50 or so lbs of titanium with serial nuimbers. didnt find those but the passports survived . f me

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Yeah exactly we found a passport right?

No engines no porcelain but a paper passport was found.

Me thinks DEW no planes ever hit twin towers but what I know ?

Dr Judy Woods knows

Dick Cheney knows

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yeah some future project they reached in and got . (who said that ? )

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I've lately come to theorize that the Apollo 1 disaster, the fire that killed the original 3 astronauts assigned to land in the moon, was a deliberate act. A signal to anyone that might spill the beans about the whole thing being a hoax that they'd better keep their damn mouths shut.

It was very effective. What a gruesome and hellish way to die.

Ya know? This would explain everything.


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Yes, Grissom's son did his own investigation and found a set up that contributed to the fire. Grissom was going to tell the truth so they got rid of him. Rather than a great accomplishment, Apollo was full of deception, murder, and criminality.

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well nasa is an evil organization. Murder is just another ho hum nazi...operation paperclip extension the nazis won the war and now they are here ...telling us we are 1/2 nazis wtf what the hell is a 1/2 nazi whats the other half is there a test for that? a PCR test? blood test?

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My dad knew one of these guys

This is like the assassination of JFK

EACH president was shown to a dark room

Saying this too could happen to you!!!

I will look at link

I jumped down a rabbit hole of flat earth

NASA was highly despised by these people

So anything nasa does is looked at with a grave suspicion.

The origins of nasa begins operation Paperclip

Von what’s his name the rocketry wizard

Even Walt Disney was apart of this group as well.

So every time I read nasa this nasa that

Thinking this is not space exploration but

Another bull shit Nazi extension of a cabal that lies ….

Not a fan of nasa

Show me a real picture of earth not done damn cgi artistic rendition lol

Just fucking show me !!!

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"Flat earth" is a scam and a hoax designed deliberately to poison any kind of truth movement. The earth is not flat and anyone purporting that it is, is an enemy of the truth, an enemy of humanity, snd an enemy of mine. And should be immediately banned and removed. Have a nice day.

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Did I ever say the earth was flat? I’ve considered it. When a navy man who is charge of missiles fires upon an enemy ship

Two miles away but never considers the curvature of the earth just consider that

Wow your so open minded Phillip

Immediately you accuse me of something I didn’t claim was fact! Fuck the enemy

This is how we tear each other a part

If your not open minded to consider

No road no rail ever considers the curve

Of the Earth? Obama said he had no time to argue with flat Earthers ….I decided to find out just what the hell this was about.

You can befriend Obama I’ll do my own


Phillip mathematically consider if no engineer ever accounts for the curve of the earth then that’s a good question to


I made it 67 years without you I’ll proceed

Just fine another 67 years

Be offended own your offense it’s all yours

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Very open minded if you. But you could have thought about it for a .0000001 of a second and realized it's a stupid psyop.

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DUDE :-0 open minded is willing to be open with a mind 2 requirements .... 1/2 truths do not get you to where you willingly suspend your ruts of being taught what you thought you knew. When you go to a movie you suspend reality for 2 hours .....or do you just say ohhh I know it all goes ohhh really?

good luck

the trouble with most people is they are stuck


and pontificate

never investigate

like the bat came from the market

the herd immunity is just a mask no 2 mask no 1 mask away park it

like the vaxxine is safe and effective

roll up you damn sleeve then

like open means open to the infinite possibilities that God exist that rocks sing that mushrooms

are connected to some interlocking psycic connection..


go take some lsd

or psylisibum mushrooms and tell me what then is reality

right thought so......

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No ITS NOT ....I am the most open minded person that lived and the Earth is Flat....

and obviously nothing I say here will change your mind....

you go look

the earth is flat

and pin prick the false globe

that sits in every classroom

that is sacred once sold

and how about the hollow moon

that is land locked

and we go spinning

spinning at 1,000 mph on our axis

while the kings and queens collect their taxes

while we chase the sun that is only 93 million miles away

as the galaxy spins at 500,000 mph in its e =mc squared mythical masses

as time space bend the false artificial time of day

and every night the hollow moon is mysterious to its sacred woman's bliss


the navy guy,

the submarine guy,

the surveyor guy,

the flight instructor guy,

the artillery guy

the earth is flat

show me

just because they stuck a globe in your classroom does not make the earth flat

Does water ever bend?

Go to the ocean and see the curve ??

Dude I am telling you ...thanks for reminding me

Go read study what the Bible says on the link the 4 corners of the earth

go investigate the flight plans in the southern hemisphere

Go ask



dude I was born in Missouri SHOW ME

and do not send some cgi picture of the earth

consider this they lied about the moon landing


Too big too fail


what makes you think this may be the biggest lie yet

prove to me the earth is spinning

i follow the moon the stars etc

but if the earth is spinning so fricken fast as we hurl through space

I care not what you think actually like a friend said it matters not the shape of the planet but the shape of your heart

bet ya a dozen donuts

also consider that a Jesuit Priest concocted the big bang theory

I was not here at the beginning but I do look into the eyes of people and realize we just did not just happen from an explosion.

Christ walked on water

the water was flat

the ocean is flat

the psyops is the globe

now prove to me its round ...i have gone through this before

this is where habit where education wher propaganda where closed minds just assume bc their minds are cluttered witn so called experts

well fuck the experts i use my eyes to see and witness

Prove to me the earth is what you say

93 million miles to the sun how do ya know thats true?

idk i just keep asking questions

why would planes have curved windows?

why would a pilot say nope Ive been up there its flat IDK i am just challenging everything

like i said lived 67 years withouit just fine the rest of my next 67 years just saying meet at the heavens and then tell me ....my first ? to the Lord ?

shape of earth

aint stupid i really do not care what you think stupid is a loaded word ....000000000000001 no fight no blame good day dude have a nice life

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How do I block you?

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THX !!! I will look at in a bit. I jumped down this rabbit hole and came away convinced that the earth is not what they taught us. For numerous witnesses who honestly asked some very profound questions. IF a Navy specialist says he fires a laser guided missile never accounting for the curvature of the earth...makes one ponder. When the engineers who build long roads, or railtracks never consider the curve, when there has never been a real picture of earth from a space vehicle

with the cgi and the ever present globe in our science class. When we are suppose to be spinning at 80,000 MPH spinning ....when water always lays flat one comes away challenged challenging what the eyes see and not what conventional wisdom says. I will look again. THX

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IF you may please connect to my email duffmcandie@yahoo.com bc now I will again revisit this too

because I did go look at Biblical accounts...and do know the Flood was covered in all history of many ancients. "guided discovery" yes always helps to just have one other to bounce ideas off.

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Hmmm ... so if I'm struggling to just keep a house clean and pay the bills, exactly how I am supposed to add these bits of theory to my psyche? I think I will just side with "I don't know" until a better time. Gotta pick your battles, and I've picked mine.

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You just go right ahead and clean your house.

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It’s been nearly three decades since JFK government planned and executed public murder and two decades since the 9/11 government planned and executed murder of nearly 3000 innocents and demolition of seven World Trade Center buildings... yes... seven, the entire World Trade Center demolished. I have no patience left.... none.... for people who don’t question and read! There has been literally hundreds of books written by deep dive serious researchers about both JFK and 9/11, hundreds of investigative documentaries and videos, how someone with obviously no clue can question “bits of theory” at this point is beyond absurd, or just plain lazy ignorance. We are in this current Covid chaos because of ignorance, most having obviously never picked up a comprehensive review of literally thousands of non fiction authors research into crimes committed by government... our government. How many books have you.... whomever is reading this.... has read any non fiction 4/5 star reader evaluated books on JFK? 9/11? Covid? Bits of theory!?!?! One of the first and imo best exposé’s written about the coordinated corroborated crimes executed by our own corrupt government is titled “JFK to 9/11 Fifty Years of Deep State by Laurent Guyanot https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/jfk-9-11-laurent-guyenot/1120325549 hopefully the reader will be enticed to want to know more, read more, perhaps even finally get to a place to start reading about Covid, how long the UN and WEF planned this psyop scam to destroy all nations into one global slave state with the cooperation of bought and paid for government actors.... and citizens bought it hook, line and sinker... when will the public wake up to the reality that “ official narrative” means look behind the curtain!

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ExAAActly.... ALL so perfectly said!! It's beyond frustrating to continually watch literally eVeryone around me just shrug their shoulders, continually smother what little self thought process they have with all the MSM bs, and simply go on about their merry lil happy ways. Sighhh... OH, OH...cuz, siLLy me, Biden said Covid is over!! So all mUst be right with the world and our corrupt Gov't again.🤦🏻‍♀️

Hey ThAnks for the book recommendation!!

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Of course... thank you for your essential perfect comment!! Yes.... beyond frustrating... and as soon as we comment to a friend or family a fragment of the plethora of information a available via trusted alt news sources, how quickly we can tell where they get their news!!! Omg... and try to tell them Obama made it legal to propagandize American citizens in 2012 (as if that stopped the msm prior) or that the media is the mouthpiece for whatever the government needs the masses to buy into... so right, silly me for trying! Anyway thanks!!

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O...M...G...yup. Youuu said it!! It's become so compLEtely unnerving that I rarely have verbal contact with anyone, let alone get together socially. I send important, nEED to know...oh pleaSe, PLEASE get your heads out of the sand...info, and.........dead...silence. Guess I should be thankful for not getting cursed at anyway. But seriously... I've caught mYself backing off at times cuz, I want to just SCREAM at them!! Thanks so much for sharing!! It's thIS contact here, with like-minded, understanding people like you, that keeps me going and resets that negative energy, so...big ThAnks!! Stay strong!!

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Point taken, thank you for sharing

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You’re welcome... I hope you read Guyanot... it’s a start....

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Well stated Maureen and everyone else here.

I often wonder what determines the point, at which people are able to see through the blinders, of myth, lore, patriotic stories and propaganda...most from hollyweird...as many here, have astutely observed.

For me it was being in the military for 15 years and seeing that machine from the inside...big eye opener, then Clinton (both wastes of skin) and Obama, then these last three years, which pretty much pulled the lids off the rest of the cans, in the mental cupboard.

I have always been a skeptic, worst case scenario guy, but until the scamdemic, I never realized how little I was questioning.

Having said that, I ran across the Substack writer/post below. For you who are blinder-less and know just about everything government or establishment adjacent is a lie, scam or scheme, the following will pull you into a new and deeper rabbit hole. One that will rattle the few cage bars, you have left. She also brings a British side to the realization, that everything has to be suspect, for those in power, to be reigned in. There is a bit of a comprehension curve to be had in her post. I read it 3 times, and it sank in. Stick with it and go back and read it again. If you believe the lunar landing was faked, this will blow your mind....unless you have already come across this info, then you'll sit back and say, what took you so long to get this.


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Reporting on this incredible recommendation of Ms Frances Leader substack… actually I have been reading nearly 3 hours this morning reading and rereading, plus the many insightful comments, two from you, the Hamlisch625 arguments, heady painties in a wad Matt Ehret idioms. I resonated with Ramola D reminding me of Anna von Reitz’s American State National extensive life work, sadly read when life was all about work rather than to concentrate on making my work about unearthing life’s truths, which now feels like a full time job just reading, researching and trying to discern what’s fact from fiction. There were so many references, articles and videos that I saved to read and watch recommended to Ms Leader which will require many more hours, but you are correct, I’ve been for the most part blinder-less about governments probably since the Viet Nam killing fields… I was at Kent State May 4 1970, part of honestly mostly peaceful kids protesting, we were no part of the loud speaker provocateurs… the shock of Gov Rhodes NG orders and the shock of killing college kids is as alive and vivid in me as then…so blinder-less definitely fits. I’ll leave it there for now.

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Full time job indeed...this must have been what it was like for investigative journalists, in their hay day and when they existed in great numbers. Now, the sifting of mountains of information, must be done by everyday people, after work and on weekends...maybe that's how it should have been...when we place our trust in third parties, we set ourselves up for deception and ruin.

I've also been slowly tilling this soil, and came across the material below. It looks to be a longer version of the information in Frances' post, including some definitions. This for me, added much needed puzzle pieces, to the corners and edges.


An old adage, that my mother would often use...The longer a lie or deception is upheld, the worse it gets.

This is a great example of that. An agreement...maybe one that was routine back then...a transfer of ownership, power & monies, in exchange for other ownership, power & monies. It would have been of little consequence or concern to the peasants, living in a feudal system, scraping out one meal a day for survival.

Likewise, the 1213 concession with Pope Innocence (you have to love these names, viewed with hindsight) was probably a small matter to King John, in the grand scheme of things, at the time...

"As a result, the pope laid on England an interdict (1208-14), a sort of religious "strike", wherein no religious service be performed for anyone, guilty or innocent. When this didn't work, the king, himself, was excommunicated. Caving-in under that pressure, John wrote a letter of concession to the pope, hoping to have the interdict and the excommunication lifted (1213). John‘s concession which, in effect, made England a fiefdom of Rome, worked like a charm. The satisfied pope lifted the yoke he had hung on the people of England and their king."

...sure the prospect of no heaven was worrisome, but in 1213, there was no inkling of colonies in a "new world" rich with natural resources and there probably was the thought that, at some point, another agreement could be made, nullifying the above one...or alliances could be made to bring Rome to her senses or knees.

Of course history drummed on, there were 23 kings of England, between 1213 and 1776. One wonders, how many of those 23 understood or knew about, the deeper implications of the concession to Innocence.

Fast forward 809 years and the enormity of single "inconsequential" act, becomes dreadfully obvious. The longer the deception the more history piled on the layers of circumstance. We now, in this time, are like people playing a game of Jenga...removing clues, that will inevitably topple the tower.

As I have said before, the last 3 years alone, should have made people understand that just because you don't want something to be true, doesn't mean it's not.

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You’re on a roll CTD... this is an acknowledgement that leads back to an interest in you’re awakening within the military. I have a feeling there are many especially veterans who would find your path to truth an interesting read, perhaps this is an urge for you to substack yourself, though catharsis can be heavy and exhaustive. Back to the templars to our current struggle to understand the system and agenda, importantly who are the authentic truth tellers... who is selected positioned controlled opposition.... how do we correctly identify scripted theatre from veiled realities.... how do we protect ourselves, how do we prepare... urgent certainly is the financial debacle looming... it’s deeply troubling the overt evidence how many have never even questioned the past 30-36 months....

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Thank you! Nice to meet you Connecting the Dots... love the challenge! Not at a place I can do the article justice as you suggest, perhaps even warn, til morning, but looking forward to it! Again thank you, and for sharing your history of awakening...

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They'll wake up when the solar flare hits and creates an EMP that wipes out all communications and electric generation/transmission. But they won't know what to do because the chip in their brain is no longer receiving instructions from AI, which was also destroyed by the EMP.

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Graphene Oxide is being put into Covid 'vaccines' to control populations everywhere http://stateofthenation.co/?p=134760

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Well when one runs out of dishes, it's got to happen. I'm not dismissing your post. Just expressing my increasing amount of being overwhelmed, but I'm sure I'm not alone. Daily keep up is just not the same anymore because of trying to spread the word.

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Making us feel overwhelmed is a key part of the plan. When we're strung out, we tend to shut down and focus on things near to us, and we lose sight of what they're doing to us.

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Sep 23, 2022·edited Sep 23, 2022

Agreed. Though hopefully, we survive long enough we learn to develop a "taste" for the truth--like healthy food-- and develop more stable internal reference points for reality that aren't just someone else's manufactured lies, greed, power, and propaganda.

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Balance. But yes I do understand, I'm probably the opposite of a clean freak, but everyone has some standards. I do not need to understand, research, or know the absolute truth about everything to know I'm just a peon in the eyes of some very powerful people. That said, thank you for the post. I realize this is now the Age of Questioning and rightly so.

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I often say “they” have done more than ‘flood the zone,’ they’ve unleashed a tsunami.

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"Clean your room" is one of the great nuggets of wisdom from Jordan Peterson.

Can't do much about the moon landing, but I can dang well clean my room!

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Btw, the battle I was referring to was fighting the vax mandates, censoring, corruption and misinformation, not cleaning my house. But alas, I can see now why the misunderstanding. Sorry it was taken that way.

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Trying to keep your daily life (just like your home) as simple and uncluttered as possible is one thing. But if more people were aware of the huge deceptions that have taken place in this world (at our expense).. we'd be far less likely to go on falling for it.

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Ha ha ha, "as simple and uncluttered as possible" ... I let go of that a long time ago. I'm not retreating on anything or dismissing anything. It's tucked away to be accessed when I'm able to. Just a matter of balance which is nearing impossible for the working class. I'm working on something soon. Sharing information is great, but specific call to action better.

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As I recently explained to a friend regarding info fatigue...consider this.

Imagine you are in a foxhole in Germany, as a soldier in WWI.

You have been deployed for several months now...and are entering your 6th day stuck in a foxhole, as the battle rages around you.

You have no options per se. You are at war...in a battle. You cannot just leave. That is your reality.

Everyone in the foxhole with you all agree...they too want to leave.

Of course they do...but they are in a war....almost certainly started by the very same families we are fighting today.

Is this fun? No.

Is this easy? No.

Is this what I hoped for at this stage of my life? No.

But this is our reality.

This is not a netflix show we can pause to make popcorn and forget about life for awhile.

We ARE in a war that none of us asked for...that we will lose if we quit.

We all feel like you do...but we all must play a role in our victory...tired or not...dirty dishes or not.

My friend expressed it almost exactly like you...only different words.

Life has changed. It is not going back to how it was...because we have enemies who desire our destruction.

We all hear you. Stay strong.

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Sage advice. Thank you for an excellent analogy. I will stay strong. I mean, I don't really have a choice. I have children. I value their health, lives, my own, and I care about others. There was a misunderstanding, and I see that now. I hold no grudge, no need to retreat, and I will carry on with what needs to be done. I am working on a post/project that will take a lot of effort, but I know I have to do it.

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I have read your replies.

You are a very admirable individual.

God bless Lee.

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There were some piranhas down stream, so I came back up here, to post this...saves on the back and forth.

As Mark said below, you do, what works for you.

Life is busy and finding the time to jump down these rabbit holes is hard.

I think what many here are saying, at a base level, is after the last 3 years, we should all be skeptical of EVERYTHING government adjacent. You know that as well as anyone, based solely on your want to educate people, about the scamdemic.

Dr. Mike Yeadon suggested the following

"experimentally adopt the position that our government is actively working to harm us, to dismantle modern society & enslave all people in a digitally controlled totalitarian world, It all fits. Nothing is surplus."

Adopting a new paradigm, can be done without breaking into your schedule or having to sift through pages of material. Try it and see if the things you hear and see daily, make more sense based on their explanation or the skeptical one, you are experimenting with.

Keep pushing truth, where you can.

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Take your time and read JFK and the Unspeakable: Why He Died and Why It Matters, by James Douglass.

Then, An Act of State: The Execution of Martin Luther King, by William Pepper

Reading those two books will give you an entirely new perspective on the US history. Before long, you'll question US entry into both world wars. I you think your cognizance is dissonant now, wait till you read those two well documented books.

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After the house is clean, give a little time to steel your psyche and challenge yourself. You are not obliged to accept it all, but read the refutations, ponder, read some more, ponder, and then rest a bit. Our minds have been very tampered with by the media and the PTB.

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Fwiw, knowing doesn’t change much. Just keep it in the back of your head so when SHTF, you’ll be on your way to being emotionally prepared.

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I think knowing changes everything.

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I appreciate the encouragement. I'll think on it, while I'm doing the dishes lol. Like I said balance. I need to continue to eat so I can still read! A lot can get lost in text, my "battle" I've chosen are the vax mandates and people getting misled about "safe and effective".

These other topics are bombshells for some for sure, and a lot to present all at once. While I'm not saying true or false to any of them right now, doesn't mean I don't or won't have an opinion at some point. If they weren't points of contention, there would have been no point to putting it out there.

No one person knows everything. I read many substacks and I while I admire several, there is not a single substacker that I have agreed with everything they have said. I would rather take time to review information from all different sources before saying nay or yay.

The topics are also different and should be addressed separately even though there could be or is overlap. We are all on different timelines and phases. I just hope we arrive at the same place faster than how we have been proceeding.

Again, I appreciate this post. It was more of a mental note to make sure I process further, not an outright dismissal as some have taken it. Likely just a misunderstanding. Peace!

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Wow this is eye opening. My focus on substack the last five months has been letting people be aware of how people are getting misled, and now I'm getting jumped on. Less friendly of a community than I thought. Again I did not say I refute, just a lot to handle when the prez says it's over and mandates are in place. I struggle more with that than anything else right now. Maybe substack isn't the place for me. I did not complain about anything.

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Don’t get discouraged or derailed. I once was a believer in the official narrative about 911 and the War in Iraq. But it took years before I came to the conclusion that it was all planned in advance and that building number 7 was the ‘smoking gun’ that proved that those buildings were brought down by explosives and thermite. Many of the first responders are on record saying they heard and witnessed explosions going off inside the WTC. Barry Jennings is one. He turned up missing the day the gov’t released the NIST report, the ‘official’ explanation on why the buildings collapsed. He was likely a truth teller the gov’t couldn’t have around to contradict the narrative.

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💗 had to switch to phone to send you that 😊 I try to write non- technical, short posts, and something different than what I'm reading elsewhere on substack. Everyone has different audiences they appeal to, and that IS a good thing. What matters most is we keep forging ahead. Thank you for your kind words, I keep writing, researching, and trying for my kids, loved ones, my readers, and everyone.

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Ouch. The "battle" I was referring to was the vax mandates, censoring, misinformation, and corruption, not cleaning my house.

This is what my substack is about and what I spend most of my waking hours on. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

I give the K family no attention, neither any of the Depp/Herd stuff. It's none of my business. Again, sorry for the misunderstanding. I tried to explain in many areas of this thread the same. Anyways, I'm moving on from it, knowing now it was a misunderstanding.

I've praised Mark Crispin Miller many times for the work he's doing, nothing changes that.

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You’re being kind. Many clearly are frustrated and are not being kind. I understand what you mean, though. When you wade into this stuff and people are screaming at you (and practically frothing from rage) that you’re being lied to, you still have to take it with a grain of salt and evaluate. And the way the message is given matters. I have a brother-in-law who screams this kind of thing constantly, but his demeanor and condescending attitude is offputting and kills his message. If I can do nothing about JFK or 9/11 besides have an intellectual curiosity, when I’m not overtaxed with literally dealing with my own mess, then it’s something. We’re always wondering how to reach people - well, screaming at them and demeaning them for asking a question isn’t it.

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I reread what I wrote and through a different lens I can see how it was taken differently than I meant. MCM usually writes about covid deaths, and this post was a bit of a surprise for me, that's all. When your own prez, and other global leaders as well, mandate something that is not good for people, threatens their life and health, it leads me to believe that anything may and could have occurred. Why I cannot dispute anything at this point except that which I do know about. Thank you for your time. Tomorrow is a new day. A fresh start with many possibilities.

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The WTC7 collapse is cited by many as the big tell, but for people who understand how tall buildings are designed and built, the collapses of WTC 1+2 are equally ridiculous, if not more so. For WTC 1+2, no confession is needed--the basic physics and building engineering principles are more than enough to demonstrate that the planes were yet another ‘magic bullet’.

Here’s a post I shared elsewhere on this topic.

9/11 is the big lie based on ‘Terrorism’; Covid is the big lie based on ‘Virus’. All part of a grand tapestry of deception.


The very first tell was visible exactly as the first tower began to fall. I watched it happen on TV, about 45 minutes after the planes hit the buildings. Strangely, the second tower struck collapsed before the first. Weird.

The collapse that unfolded went against every structural engineering principle known and employed to construct buildings of this size. I saw the buildings fall straight down at astonishing speed. Basic physics seemed suspended. I was shocked.

The WTC towers are a Type I structure, which require 3 hours of fire protection. This is because Type I structures don’t have a height limitation. Very tall structures require time to evacuate and deploy firefighters. So while a two story apartment building might only have a 1 hour rating, tall buildings are held to a stricter standard. This is primarily driven by insurance, as most building codes have been since their inception. This doesn’t mean 3 hours to collapse, but 3 hours until a certain level of deformation takes place. The building is still expected to stand, not collapse. In real life, no fire-protected Type I building has ever suffered catastrophic collapse before or since the WTC. This is very important.

We have to remember that these were, at one time, the tallest towers on the planet. They weren’t built to simply *meet* the building codes of the time, but to vastly *exceed* them. These towers were designed with a highly redundant structural system that paired vertical load bearing and shear resistance in its interior and a web-like network of structural steel at its perimeter that lent the towers remarkable stiffness and resiliency (an essential characteristic for tall buildings subjected to hurricane force winds which can come from any direction). In addition to the robust redundancy of the structural design, all of the steel was either encased or covered with fire-protective material, be it concrete, gypsum, or asbestos-containing coatings available at the time.

I have personally worked intimately on the design and construction of these kinds of tall buildings, and when I saw these buildings collapse on that fateful day, I knew immediately it was an Op. And a very large and elaborate one.

On that day, the TV told me to ignore training, education, and experience, and just be afraid. It told us that somehow jetliners crashing into the buildings made them fall, like Luke Skywalker—a single X-Wing taking down the Death Star. That’s fine for a movie plot line, with accompanying special effects; but from a structural engineering perspective, it’s utter fantasy. It would take much more than a single plane, and the collapse wouldn’t have looked like that. What it looked like was controlled demolition. Full stop.

Every structural engineer and architect worth their salt should have jumped out of their seats and exclaimed, “WTF?” Instead, most sat and waited, silent. My team members and peers were curiously silent, hesitant to ask questions. Most said nothing and changed the topic when probed. They were uncertain. Afraid to speak out. Like an unmasked person in a crowd of masked faces, they feared being isolated. Perhaps there was something they didn’t know?

There were so many angles to pick this apart based on basic principles, but almost no one noticed and fewer said anything. No one seemed to see the rate of fall, the way the collapse self-corrected early on at the top third. No one seemed to question how it is that relatively minor damage to one side of a redundant structure played out as a very uniform and organized collapse.

Almost that very day, a blanket of silence spread out over the topic. It was as if a mass suggestion spell had been cast and nearly everyone had bought the ruse. It was as if the TV and headlines had been scripted beforehand, structured to obscure and direct inquiry away from the forensic evidence. Is it any wonder that the overwhelming majority of the steel remains were quickly freighted off to asia for smelting? Forensic examination wasn’t a goal, it was to be avoided.

Many point to the Pentagon and the Pennsylvania crash as big tells, but for me, it was the WTC collapses that spoke volumes. Basic physics, Newtonian Mechanics, high rise design principles, all had been violated; and we’re not talking about particle physics here, but basic principles that have been used to design buildings for centuries. How could this possibly be?

Immediately, within the space of weeks, the industry rags devoted special issues reporting theories of collapse. The theories were all ridiculous, but like the NEJM or the Lancet, does anyone question Architecture or Structure? Never mind that all of a sudden, the normal advertisements changed on a dime to market security bollards, fire-rated glass, and terrorist-resistant building security systems. The people who read these initial theories fell into three camps: skeptics, acceptors, and those who stayed silent. I would estimate around 75% were acceptors, 5% were skeptical, and 20% were afraid to give voice to their questions.

Much like the doctors during the pandemic outbreak, only a few professionals in connected fields spoke out, many were cowed into silence, and a great many went along in blind acceptance. Honest truth: a huge number of architects suck at structural engineering, even on an intuitive level, and outsource even fundamental design to engineers—they like to spend an inordinate amount of effort on prettifying the packaging. People who raised questions were drowned out by official pronouncements via NIST and the media.

What followed reads like a template for now. Computer models were created to cartoon animate a brand-new phenomena: Progressive Collapse. Mathematics professors were called upon to write papers demonstrating the mathematics, proving the theory. Most people couldn’t understand the language or read the papers being written. But those who could, knew the computer model was bullshit and the mathematics made no sense. I waded through the poorly written paper and confirmed it was another part of the Op.

The most oft-cited paper at the time basically tried to argue that through a combination of potential energy and momentum of collapsing floors one could numerically demonstrate that there was adequate energy in the system to demonstrate the feasibility of the collapse. What laypeople didn’t know, and what the reporting in this failed to grok, is that the equations in that paper were based on a fantasy. The analysis failed to account for the total amount of energy required to demonstrate not just the collapse, but the observable evidence: cutting of massive steel beams and columns, the pulverizing of enormous amounts of concrete into dust, along with corrugated steel, truss joists, even connecting bolts, so much reduced to dust and slag. The paper was an exercise in obfuscation—using math to bolster the psyop, invisible to all but the most intrepid.

There is nothing that will cause a steel frame structure to pancake collapse at close to free fall speed without removing vertical support below the falling mass first. This is fundamental. All of the structural connections and supports below the falling mass have to fail at each floor in order without affecting the speed of collapse. If the mechanism cited by the paper had been true, you would have observed slowing collapse, not a uniform one. Further, the pile of rubble at ground level would more likely have been a broken stack of floor plates, and not the overwhelmingly atomized debris sprayed out over many city blocks in all directions.

Eventually this deeply deceptive model was refined and tweaked, with various propositions suggesting failure of poorly-applied fire-proofing and faulty truss joist connections as the culprits behind the failure. Much of this made its way into the 9/11 Commission report even though it is all an elaborate lie. But telling a lie repeatedly to people that don’t understand the basis for the lie has been shown to be a very effective strategy. Eventually, fortified by ‘official’ decree, even the basic laws of physics must bow.

Very few considered that the towers had undergone retrofitting in the years leading up to the collapse, much of the work happening at night to avoid disruptions to public business operations. Funny that.

In the end, not very different from a virus (relatively small fire with poor fuel stock) somehow ripping through the population (the first ever/since examples of catastrophic failure in buildings of this type due to fire), mass dissemination of prepared mathematical manipulation, mixed with copious amounts of fear messaged through the media (Bin Laden, Bin Laden, Bin Laden), followed by governmental mandates (Patriot Act) and actions (War), benefitting the super-rich (war profiteers and the security state).

There’s that old adage about repeating history when we fail to understand it…

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This is really good. I usually don't read long comments, but this makes a point I've never heard before. And I watched the towers fall live so I remember and now that you explain it, I myself, just a layman, can see it now. It's like looking at one of those trick pictures where you see a lovely woman one way and then when you look at it again, you see an old hag. Even if a single plane could cause an entire tower to fall, it wouldn't have happened the way it did. It was too perfect. The buildings just settled into their foundations. It was a controlled demolition. Now that I see it, I can't see it any other way.

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This comment alone makes the writing worth it. Thank you. 🙏🏽

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What’s noteworthy too, is that the WTC owner, Larry Silverstein, would have nightly conversations with Israeli PM Benjamin Netanyahu prior to the ‘attacks’. (Silverstein would normally be having his breakfast in one of the restaurants in the upper floors of the WTC the day of the ‘attacks’, but ‘just happened’ to have a doctor’s appointment).

Connect that dot to the planned invasion of Iraq prior to 911 by PNAC, Project for New American Century, a neocon think tank group (likes of Bill Kristol, Paul Wolfowitz, Richard Perle, Dick Cheney, Charles Krauthamer, etc.). They just needed their ‘Pearl Harbor moment’ to get their plan rolling. 911 was it!

Pat Buchanan wrote a great article at the outset of the Iraq War, exposing who was pushing for it. Great read and worth bookmarking:

Whose War?


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Yes, there are all sorts of connecting threads from various directions. The PNAC angle is especially important.

That said, the point of the write up I shared was to focus on the twin tower collapse and consider that somewhat on its own; partly as an example of a very obvious set of tells that occurred in the moment, live on television, and the manipulations and propaganda that followed as it parallels what we have just lived through.

I believe part of the reason why the public is easily discombobulated on these big ops is precisely because, in addition to the fear, there is an absolute avalanche of information directed at them. Most people experience overwhelm, and shut down. They then rely on someone else to explain to them what happened. And at that point, people can be told anything—and if it reinforces some other belief they have, it usually slips right by the radar (if the radar is even on).

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David Martin said that the insurance for the twin towers either lapsed or was canceled on Sept. 10, 2001.

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I remember reading that Silverstein had another policy drawn up that changed the coverage right before.

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I can’t get past the toasted cars, some of which had engine assemblies of plastic and different metals melted into an unrecognizable glob. Also the Bankers Trust building across the street from the towers had a gash down the front that they were going to try and repair, but the interior steel beams were so degraded that they had to tear the whole thing down. Those two things plus all the other stuff are just too much to believe the official story.

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The really striking ones are the half-toasted vehicles, plastic trim still intact. Cop cars with the front end roasted, back half almost untouched.

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Yeah, hundreds of them. Judy Woods’ book has a lot of pictures of them.

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Excellent essay. Thank you.

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You’re most welcome. Thank you for reading it.

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I think it's the best description of what happened that I've ever read. You write very clearly. I appreciate all the detail you went into.

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I could not agree more, Truthbird.!.

Mr. TFish - your account of 'what waS vs. what couldn't pOssibly be', is just... WoW. Phenomenal explanation and detail. ThAnk you, for taking the time to share!! This is going into a physical collection of truths I'm making to give to my still blinded, jab'd family and loved ones. To fully understand this pLandemic, they do hAve to see aLL the critical points in history (last 150yrs or so) for what they truly are. Your writing is quite the eye opener. EVeryone needs to read this!! ENDless gratitude❣️

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I’m glad this resonated with you. I hope it helps!

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I'm confident it will. Thank you again!!

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Thank you for that kind comment. It’s always a challenge to describe succinctly, but with adequate detail. It’s nice to know it made sense to you.

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Too bad more people didn't read and "like" your comment! I think most people tend to skip over long comments as a matter of course. It's a shame, especially when there's a really valuable, well-written one like this.

I like to write long comments too (relatively long, anyway) and I'm aware that their length makes it less likely that they'll be read. But I do so anyway, when it feels important to me. It takes quite a lot of time and care to write a lengthy comment that's worthwhile posting.

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Yes, it takes time and care, for sure. With a subject as important as this one, I feel it’s important not to be slapdash and avoid errors and misunderstanding, which is easy to do on a topic like this.

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Really appreciate your perspective. Thank you

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Thank you for reading it.

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Thank you

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First of all, let me say that I worked on the Apollo project from 1968-1972 as a junior test engineer at the MIT Instrumentation Lab in Cambridge, Mass.I ended up working there for 40 years until 2008. These were some pretty, pretty, pretty smart dudes that I worked for and with. My boss of 30+ years was number two in the class of 1963 at MIT. The man did calculus in his head. I met several of the astronauts when they toured the lab.

Up until the 2000s, had you posed this theory, I would have had a serious disagreement with you. However, at this point in time (I'm 75) I am not so sure. Covid really put me over the top. Anything can be faked and or distorted to the point of seeming real. At some point, you have to trust someone. I just don't think that it is government in any shape or form.

All the other events you posed, I"m with you 100%.

Good info as usual Mark.

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Thanks so much. I appreciate it; and let me add that I'm no different from you or anybody else in this regard, since I too have initially fallen for all too many intoxicating narratives—including COVID, which, for the first months, had me tightly masked, pushing elevator buttons with my elbows, and otherwise succumbing to the panic. It wasn't until I watched a number of grass-roots videos showing NYC hospitals standing empty, while the media were screaming that all those facilities were "overrun," that I snapped out of it. That kind of experience is all-important, if one is willing to pursue it.

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I worked there too until 1986. I can see how compartmentalization can work since my boss never shared anything with me about what we were working on.

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So much to digest, but digest we must.

Personally, as for 9/11, I no longer subscribe to the "controlled demolition" explanation of how the towers came down, due to the fact that the buildings actually turned to dust mid-air and there was very little debris from those two monster-sized towers + WTC 7. For further study, read Dr. Judy Wood's excellent book "Where Did the Towers Go?" Dr. Wood's work is highly compelling.


And check out some video explanation from this site, or any other site you come across in your inquisitiveness, and as always, use skepticism, critical/analytical thinking and logic.


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Nonsense. You can even see pictures of the big beams cut at a standard 45deg angle typical of cutting charges. Then didn't turn to dust mid-air, some of the concrete & wallboard were pulverized by the explosions and force of the freefall acceleration.

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Read the book, then make your conclusions.

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There’s a video of some of the outside cladding turning to dust on the way down.

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I think it’s important to be specific about the language we use.

The physical evidence and video footage makes plain the insane amount of energy that was added to produce the failures. There is insufficient evidence to completely ‘prove’ all of the mechanisms at work; but clearly, the official narrative is ridiculous.

Whatever means was employed to trigger the structural failure, it is, in fact, a form of controlled demolition, technically speaking—though clearly not a conventional method relying solely on standard explosives or thermite. It is quite possible that there were multiple methods employed in combination.

Not all of the steel was pulverized, though a large amount apparently was atomized. Significant steel assemblies remained in the rubble, some appearing to indicate use of cutting charges. There was, in fact, steel removed from the site and sent to Asia for resmelting. Simultaneously, an inordinate amount of building mass was reduced to silt-like particulate, without visible cause. The rubble after the collapse does not appear to be a sufficient quantity of steel to account for a 100+ stories of structure. Further, some of the steel joining connections appear to show that the connecting bolts were removed or disintegrated.

The observed evidence seems contradictory, but the real is what must be dealt with. Open question: what if we are looking at ‘both/and’ rather than ‘either/or’? Both/and maps to the evidence; either/or does not.

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Sep 24, 2022·edited Sep 24, 2022

Well pieced together comment, Mr. Fish. Indeed, it could quite possibly be a 'both/and', yet after reading Dr. Wood's arguments, the explanation she theorizes is most plausible. If you have not read the book she wrote, I heartily suggest you do. It's fascinating. Yet, in sum, I don't feel a need to defend her theory so much as the fact that there is a small, yet extremely powerful cabal (with its supporting cast of minions) that, time and time again, wrecks havoc on the lives and minds of the multitudes. That is the part We the Multitudes must respond to and put in a pen.

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Sep 23, 2022Liked by Mark Crispin Miller

Thanks for writing this! There were several books early on that pointed out discrepancies. More recently the authors Sibrel, Weaver, Walsh and others have provided deep technical analysis. For instance, they were able to locate an end-to-end video of the lift off into orbit of Apollo 11. This means it was not spliced together. They measured and determined it could NOT have reached Earth orbit. It probably went into the ocean. Where were the astronauts for that time period? Remember the stresses they were under, they could not tell their wives the truth. Many of them got divorced.

The Apollo 13 capsule washed up over near Europe and the Russians got it ! The US negotiated to get it back. The whole Apollo 13 episode was a farce. A made for TV movie. Apollo had to be one of the greatest Propaganda efforts ever.

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But the other 5 times? What compelled them to do the same hoax 5 more times? You’d wonder if Apollo 13 capsule washed up &!the Russians got it, you’d think they’d be looking for the 4 capsules after that.

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Some people have suggested that Apollo turned into a way to launder money over to the Viet Nam War and keep the drugs flowing. Also James Webb, for whom the telescope is named, stepped down from NASA right before Apollo launched. Other top people did that also, this was their way of protesting, I think, without revealing the truth.

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Except he left because of the Apollo 1 fire on 1/27/67, in disgrace not because he was protesting. The CIA drug trade was going strong from the late 1940’s- 1950’s when they took over from the French.

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The 1st one was faked, but the next 5 were real?🤷🏻‍♂️😏

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No the moon landings were real. You can see the landers, rovers and their tracks still on the moon through satellite images. Not every story the MSM tells is BS. There was no reason to fake the moon landings. They don't get them to imprison the population or destroy other nations because they successfully got to the moon. And there is nothing impossible about it. China's preparing to send men to the moon by 2027. They ain't doing it so they can fake a moon landing. A backyard astronomer could see that. Musk's Starship or his Falcon Heavy are quite capable of putting Astronauts on the moon and returning them to the Earth. It may be rocket science but it is all good science. Their version of the Kennedy assassinations & 9/11 were not good science, in fact they were scientifically impossible.

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No the "tracks on the Moon" were airbrushed in by NASA. There are no independent verifications of them being on the Moon. The satellites going around the Moon can produce detail down to a foot or less. But the images of the landing sites are all smudged for a reason. Most of the Clementine images are classified. They will not let the public see the real Moon.

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You can see the Moon Reconnaissance Orbiter photos right now. And the Japanese SELENE probe to the Moon & the Chandrayaan-2 Indian Moon orbiter. It would be an incredible job to fake those. They would have to match ground observations and invent fine detail to be compatible with that. For what purpose? A crazy notion.

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If you provide a link to a photo of a "landing site" that would be helpful. None of the US NASA photos can be trusted.

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If none of the NASA photos can be trusted, where do you draw the line , spacewalks? Shuttle?, So they fake a moon landing and also all the spacewalks

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What about the Voyager space missions? Or any of them? Epistemology: how do we know what is real and true?

Then there's the opposite problem: There are things which are invisible to most people, not because they don't exist but because they're too terrifying to contemplate. I'm specifically thinking of stealth weapons, AKA directed energy weapons. I've been victimized by someone who has attacked me on a daily basis for over thirty years with this kind of weapon. Society at large ignores their existence, despite the fact that they were developed at DARPA, Satan's headquarters, decades ago. The police turn a blind eye to them. The victims of these weapons are an invisible tortured population within your midst.

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How about the Hubble repair mission?

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What about the Hubble space telescope?

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Exact same thing i was wondering

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No manned mission has reached the moon. Ask Barack Obama, who observed, correctly, that no such mission has yet been able to break out of low-earth orbit.

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This is so much to take in.

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Sep 23, 2022·edited Sep 23, 2022

I knew quite soon after 911 that it had been blown up, I read about it and not long ago saw the film. But the moon landing! I remember as a child sitting breathlessly at the TV watching... like Jonah here mentioned, if we can see through a telescope it must be there right? It is strange though that Russia never landed people even though they had lots of astronauts in space. Is there footage from the chinese landing? I suppose it was unmanned. Have to look that all up again now! Have not thought about it.

I would believe it easily if it had just been one landing. But 6 !

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NASA recently, and for the umpteenth time, "delayed" another visit to the moon. They've been delaying it for decades, even though you'd think it would _easier_ to make it back up there, what with the vast advances in the appropriate technology since 1969.

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I suspect there are plenty of people at NASA who would rather spend money on real science (like the Webb Space Telescope) than sending people to the moon. The main people I remember arguing for it were the old retired astronauts from the 60s. It's a waste of money to keep people alive in space. Or a waste of money to restage a phony landing.

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The golfing and the golf cart was the chef's kiss.

I guess they must have used lithium batteries?

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that is true. Like the companies trying to make a better jab but they can't because they did not make the first one !

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It isn't possible that we went to the moon.

In so many ways.

I hear this all the time: I saw it on TV!

That was the absolute *easiest* part of it. The media had to record/send out 'live' from a monitor. They didn't get a direct feed from NASA.

As Mark touches on. We all *wanted* to believe. It was unpatriotic to doubt. Even so, 1/3 people doubted it happened at the time. As the years pass, they've used the 'conspiracy theorist' to shout down skeptics.

This unraveled for me because of the scamdemic. I was open to the big-lie. I realized how they've been lying to us about diet (the food pyramid is upside down). Fauci's predecessor Ansel Keys lied and lied. I'd say he was the biggest killer of Americans prior to Fauci.

Anyway, all 700 cases of the telemetry data, all the original footage, all the plans for the CM and Lunar Lander are 'lost'. Gone.

I just saw an interview with one of the poor-bastards working at NASA (Artemis) where he said we *forgot* how to go to the moon...we have to relearn.

Just look at that project. It is a disaster. Mostly because they can't reveal the Apollo program was a hoax.

To be clear, the F1 engines and Satrun V rockets were developed and built. We put men in orbit and performed great feats.

One thing that bugged me was that IBM was used for all the rocket controls and in the launch vehicle. They were excluded from the CM and Lunar Lander. I think those were done at MIT.

There is so much. They almost dared us to notice. Temp swings of +/- 300F in space suits designed/built by Platex. No allocation for energy to control environment. It is so bad.

I'm an engineer. I didn't sleep for a week when this hit me. Welcome to the real world: it sucks, and It is going to get waay worse.



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"1/3 of the people doubted it at the time". Wow. This was a world completely unknown to me. Never saw people from that world in any Hollywood movies.

I guess we will have a period here in the U.S. of de-Trumanization (?), akin to the Soviet Union's period of de-Stalinization, where we have to wake up to the many lies we've been told.

I wonder if and when public schools will allow issues like this to be brought up in classrooms.

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It looked indeed like impossible, but I was a European kid. Who would have thought? 9/11 should have opened my eyes to the lunar debacle. I saw the movie with the faked moon landing. So that was the truth! Good grief. This will cause me some big thinking! At least I was a kid sitting behind the TV watching. TV is such a dangerous thing. Expecially now, with all the special effects etc. To be honest I watched some footage from back then, and I remember the landing in sea which looked so clumsy compared to the Russians landing on the ground! And to have them film the whole thing on the moon. Like the staged people falling dead in the streets of Wuhan with someone filming. (I got that almost rightaway LOL. once fooled.. well I was fooled multiple times... thank you all for the explanation!)

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Bullshit. China's already planning a human moon landing for 2027. Musk's Starship or Falcon Heavy are both capable of putting men on the moon.

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Sep 23, 2022·edited Sep 23, 2022

For a variety of reasons, it is considerably “more difficult” to go to the moon now. I put that in quotes to make a point that we don’t live in that time any longer.

Something that big needed not only the national will (desire to beat the Russians), but also an acceptance of a great deal of risk. Unlike Mercury, Gemini, and Apollo, modern spacecraft are designed and built to system safety analysis (SSA)/design redundancy closer to a modern airliner.

The very rudimentary computers made the mission very challenging but also fortuitous prevented the many development roadblocks common to todays aerospace fiascos such as F35, Dreamliner etc. One interesting metric from the B-2 development program: Each line of software required a full man-hour end to end. As I recall the B-2 was the first aerospace system to exceed a billion lines of code. No wonder it took so many accounting tricks for the Air Force to claim the price stayed under a $1B per bomber with the 20 order.

So imagine Boeing’s Orion capsule or NASA’s Artemis project. You can employ hundreds of software engineers and work them for years and still have endless SSA concerns. It’s just the nature of the complex beast. I think Elon understood this and was able deftly steer his team toward the goal and make audacious risk bets along the way.

You can take pride in America’s aerospace achievements. Fortunately there are no claims of fakery of the highest and fastest and scores of other records (X-15, SR-71 and so on), just the moon landing(s).

I do not believe the hundreds or even a thousand people who would have to be in on the charade would have also managed to keep it secret. (A 3 man CIA demo team on 7 World Trade...maybe.)

I’ve spent a career in aerospace, had the privilege of meeting many astronauts including all 3 of Apollo 11 and I have read extensively on aviation and space history.

Any doubts about their jubilation can be overcome by reading the late Michael Collins masterpiece “carrying the fire.” They are certainly smiling from the window of their quarantine facility in the famous photo talking to Pres Nixon. They also happen to be downing multiple martinis in celebration.

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I remember that photograph. Soon as it was published and translated, I bought the book. At the time I did not yet know English LOL I was 11 and in Belgium

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Sep 23, 2022·edited Sep 23, 2022

I understand that what Obama said while joking was that Air Force One hasn't broken out of low-earth orbit. Not at all what you imply.

The truth about 9/11 has not come out, I would agree with that and lord knows nobody's told the truth about the JFK assassination.

For the moon landings, I guess people can believe what they want.

My view is that we need to keep our eye on the real issue here. It's the current problems with Covid, Ukraine and all the other stuff related to the New World Order. It's hard enough to get people to understand what is happening. I don't think that complicating things by bringing up more possibilities of government lies helps the cause. We're already been labeled as conspiracy theorists....how does adding more fuel to that fire help?

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Yes, calling the moon landings fake, sounds like more CIA "poisoning the Well" strategy of turning everyone who knows 9/11 & the CIA Kennedy assassinations happened was a crackpot, tinfoil hat conspiracy nut.

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Of course the CIA would never lie !!! OMG what are you suggesting?

More seriously, the fact that our space program was essentially run by ex-Nazi's proves that there are a ton of folks who hate them and everything they achieved, just for who they were. And those same folks are busy targetting their statues and erasing them from history, just like they're erasing all of our history. Here are some guys who've been cancelled everywhere on that topic: https://dissident-mag.com/2020/07/23/ftn-weltraumwaffe-apollo-11-deep-dive/ And a quick proof of the veracity of the 1967 moon landings, and the 5 others after that, can be had by a quick screening of 1982 "Tron", about the first cgi movie. The cgi technology just wasn't there, and a lot of the aerospace back then was done on slide rules. And little bitty computers.

The country was different then, you had to kill people to get them to lie. Not like the "folks" doing the lying now.

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Sep 23, 2022·edited Sep 23, 2022

I see nobody has debunked my comment about what Obama said.

I haven't found a video but here's a transcript for everyone who is willing to believe that NASA didn't alter it:


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Only so much as it helps people to see the pattern

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Yup, this crackpot's known the story for years, never added up. The radiation alone would've killed them all just like it did the animals USSR sent into orbit. Just think of the cancer rates among air crew folks and they don't even go up that far. And oh those suits--not even made of lead--they would not protect a flea from radiation--they are worse than movie costumes (seen 'em in person, they are absurd). And the home movies were a joke--would've fogged the film (radiation fogs film totally). And the clear audio communications from the space shuttle, c'mon (911 yarn bunk too--those cell phone calls from WAY up in the air when no such tech existed, righty-oh but sure they could do that in SPACE from the 60's?)--I mean you cannot make this up folks (they did of course and people bought it--still do). Gus Grissom tried to tell us the ship was a tin foil piece of junk joke and see where it got him--poor guy, he was funny too. So many killed... The only piece I don't know--Mark? -- is if it really was Kubrick filming it on those hangars? I thought it was done in Hollywood so this new confession says nope, not the soundstage. Clearly the director was either trying to show us (which makes sense re. Kubrick) that this was staged (double impossible shadows from two light sources, inconsistent footprints, etc) OR it was a lesser director and they just messed up. That's a piece I wanna know more about!

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Adding too--as I've yet to watch the 911 confession/ about to do it now--that it does not compute that killing 3000+ people (and more if ya consider the toxic post fx) could be construed as patriotism by any intelligent CIA officer--even if they trusted Mr Evil George Sr (sonny boy just read the goat story off site) -- HOW can you spin this to someone that this is a GOOD idea?

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I read somewhere that if you had the right kind of telescope and aimed it at the moon at the right spot you could still see the flag planted and the footprints from the astronauts on the moon dust.

Granted, I never looked myself; I'm not a telescope guy.

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You can look at satellite photos online right now.


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Satellite photos from the same people that may have faked the landing. 😆😂🤣 Yeah ok. That makes sense

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No they are from India, Japan and China. Your silly conspiracy, that has no rational purpose whatsoever, keeps getting bigger. Are you saying the US Artemis and Chinese planned return to the Moon in the next 5yrs all fake too? They are spending between them maybe $80B just to make a video tape to amuse the public, is that what you're telling us?

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Its an animation. Do you think that is google maps?

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Oh, now the MRO and other orbiters like even India's are producing animations of the moon's surface meticulously edited so they agree with ground based observations. Jesus. What possible purpose would this worldwide conspiracy have? Hide alien bases on the Moon? And China faked their moon lander too I suppose. And Elon Musk is just a stupid man wasting his fortune to make rockets suited for Moon & Mars manned missions. Since you figure its impossible to do.

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Sorry! I didn’t see your post and so I posted the same link.

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Apollo 11 was observed on its path to the moon by amateur astronomers, somewhat older than me, in my immediate circle of friends. It is easy to tell the difference between a satellite in orbit and a satellite on a trajectory toward the moon.

--David Chandler, https://911speakout.org

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Even the Moon landings? Do you have a source for that? Say it ain't so Mark.

Covid, 9-11, JFK, RFK, MLK, of course we're all, those with a pulse, convinced of those lies, but the Moon landings?

I was born in the peak post WW2 baby boom year, and I've learned from experience that just about any original idea I have is being thought of at the same time by about a million other people, so if somebody can prove with math or science or something, in a way understandable to neurological pedestrians like me, that the Moon landings never happened, then that would be huge.

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You probably don't really need a source.

Just think about it. A mock-up of the lunar lander is in Smithsonian. I understand they scaled it up and the astronauts are scaled down. Why would they do that?

It is still ridiculous. +/-300degF sun to shade. DNA altering radiation. No shielding.

My guess is they plan on doing it again with Artemis. It is much more substantial. They're building a platform in moon orbit to descend from.

I want to believe, but I suspect the hammer will come down with the coming elections and Artemis will be scrubbed

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Sep 23, 2022·edited Sep 23, 2022

Totally agree with you. People do not realize that once human is out there from under protection of radiation belts, they would need very serious protection for everyone and everything, including the spaceship, and this would be impossible to haul out there, way too heavy.

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Look at the pictures:


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The Covid fraud brought me to 9-11 "truth" and strong moon landing skepticism. I've often looked at the LLM in the Smithsonian and thought how ridiculous. Just an observation about the "photos" you keep promoting. Can't say those pictures prove much. Look at the photo of the final resting spot of the rover. Zero tracks in front or back of it can be seen, yet we are supposed to believe we can see the tracks from much farther away? Yet the footprints are clear as day.

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Wow. I remember at the time as kids we laughed at a centenarian, a former slave, who said in an interview at the time "ain't nobody going to the moon". Now I'm beginning to believe he was right! Its still a lot for me to take in. I think I need to put the Ipad down for a while...

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You can find a lot of information here https://www.cluesforum.info/index.php

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Excellent source, IMO Simon Shack et al have nailed it.

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deletedSep 23, 2022·edited Sep 23, 2022
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"Other Losses" is quite a shocking eye-opener! I guess there'd be quite a few Americans with problems accepting this as fact. It reminded me of The Battle of Algiers, for many years banned in France about the atrocities committed in Algeria by the French army during the fight for liberation.

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"If you are to be a fully functioning adult, you are called on to identify your boundaries, to communicate your boundaries, and to defend your boundaries.

Those boundaries call on you to recognize evil in your midst and to stand against it. You don’t need to conquer the globalists, you just need to conquer your own life, your own family, your own home, and perhaps your own community. You need conquer evil and drive it out, wherever it exists in your circle influence. No matter how big or small that circle is, that is the work of the virtuous man.

Do that, fight that battle throughout life, stay focussed on your values, grow, and you will be unconquerable. You will have defeated evil in your midst and in your circle of influence." - Allan J. Stevo

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See this interesting video on the WTC, which was clearly a controlled demolition: https://youtu.be/lESol88wOi0

and see Paul Craig's article covering the evidence from all sides: https://www.unz.com/proberts/the-11th-anniversary-of-911/

I thank Mark Crispin Miller for having the courage to put this in his News from Underground.

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Brilliant compelling article. Question Everything. The Epic ongoing corrupt Convid-1984 experience of the last few years is a golden gateway to unravelling 'events' and orchestrated globalist lies stretching back decades and through the entire last century, or more.

As a young boy in the early 1970s I had a plastic model of the Lunar Lander (that "hilariously rickety contraption") and a map of the moon. Looking back now and with greater understanding of the harsh engineering complexities (and political deceptions), it's hard to believe that it would survive the impact of landing let alone be able to lift off again and make it back to Earth - relying on primitive puny computing capability.

When we see through the Big Lie we gain gritty clarity and are not so easily fooled about anything ever again. Organic rigorous rugged truth scrutiny and verification shatters elaborate fabricated lies and masterful deception.

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Add in the chemtrials as well, for 20+ years they have been killing us and making our lives poisoned.

Centralized large government kills, when it's allowed to profit from suffering. Like Max Igan says, step away and grow food, drop the cellphone. That last one will be tough for many, I know, but the phones make you ever more comprimisable, killable if you have had the jabs. see https://zeeemedia.com/interview/live-extended-interview-covid-19-injection-hacks-your-brain-enslavement-through-ai-with-karen-kingston/

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As for the Moon landings...

1) what about the Van Allen radiation belts?

2) getting there is one thing. How did the astronauts get back?

3) Why hasn't America - or any other country - been back in over 50 years? That's kind of inexplicable.

4) as for 9/11, I was a journalist at the time and I documented 64 anomalies that contradicted the official narrative

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Yeah how did they get back?

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They just hit the "undo" button. Jeeeze how hard is that to figure out?

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My father worked on Naval radar systems during the Korean War and upon returning worked for Lockheed Martin on the Apollo Space missions. He ‘designed’ the electronic circuitry.

He left Lockheed in 1968 and moon landing 1969.

Now the strange thing—

His next job was at MGM just as they were making 2001 A space odyssey. My parents went to the world premier.

I have never understood the connection between Apollo and MGM in his job history. My sister rationalised that he was just working with accounts. Well, what about developing radar?

On another note - he was present when Kennedy was killed in Los Angeles.

He never spoke of his work on NASA or MGM. He gave it all up and went for having a car dealership.

Weird Huh?

I can’t find the link, but off-guardian posted an old 1960’s Sci-Fi drama from the bbc. I believe it was called News Busters. All about how the computer decides the news narrative and the crew make up the visuals. They show the Moon Landing set (all miniatures). Made before moon landing.


“ Earth's average surface gravity is about 9.8 meters per second per second. When an object is tossed off a building top or a cliff apex, for instance, it accelerates toward the ground at 9.8 meters per second per second. The Moon's surface gravity is about 1/6th as powerful or about 1.6 meters per second per second”

So how could you swing a gulf club and hit the golf ball?

Consider the space craft in 2001 Space Odyssey vs Apollo space mission. Which looks most likely to make it out of our orbit?

Space Odyssey ship

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Great story about your dad. Have a dad who worked on some very interesting deep state stuff too. But please explain why you think you couldn't hit a golf ball on the moon. I don't get it.

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I may be wrong about this as physics is my weakest subject. Never able to get my head around it - like a blind spot.

So as gravity less the ball would go further but surely the low gravity would have a large effect on the astronaut swinging the ball? A much larger swing if using the same effort. So wouldn’t control of the golf club being swing single handed be thrown (esp as gloved) then hit a ball?

The whole thing about golf is the weight of the iron in the hand and the swing being exactly right onto the small target ball. They were supposedly bouncing about themselves and falling over. That astronaut must have been a superhuman mature man (having been in orbit early in 1960’s).

It was like a theatrical performance as this video sounds to me like.


It took him a only a minute to get the hang of the self fashioned club without a head (by appearance only). It took only the second attempt to make contact. But takes me a non golfer often much more then that to hit the ball and make it travel. And UK Scientists have discovered the ball on the moon using powerful microscopes. Kind of like needle in a haystack.

It simply lacks credibility. Just like the waving flag. As does the whole story of losing the original tapes and the technology to replicate Apollo space missions.

Too many holes in the story.

However I will concede that after much training an expert golfer probably could learn to golf in low gravity environments.

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Yes the "dog ate my homework" excuse about "losing the technology" is the most obvious thing ever. That and the fact that the young scientists employees there speak openly and excitedly (and on camera!) about sending humans past the Van Allen Radiation Belts in the near future FOR THE FIRST TIME. It's so bad that the Apollo trips seem like a silly bad joke that everyone is now in on, but doesn't talk openly about.

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Our entire reality is fake and scripted

The World Is A Stage


Death of the Queen and Numerical "Coincidences"


The Hidden History of the Revived Roman Empire II.Knights of Malta, Jesuit Papacy and the 9/11 Attacks


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I won't claim to know the whole story about JFK, the moon landings, 9/11, or any other momentous events, but these days I simply assume that the government is substantially lying.

Some 20 years ago, I lived next door to a former NASA engineer. He told me couple stories that would be hard to square with the official version of history. He didn't outright say it was fake, but it led me to questioning in a way I never had before.

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In what way did you question in a way you never had before. Might this type of questioning help to open the eyes of some in our current problem?

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Well, I'd always been a skeptic of government and authority - his perspective showed me that the rabbit hole was WAY deeper than I imagined.

We're living in a manufactured reality.

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We talk about this a lot. It provokes the same kind of anger as questioning COVID. It's part of a status reality that shapes the way people think.

There's a very compelling case that the moon landings were simulated, but it isn't important whether they were or not. There really can't be a definitive answer for everyone. No matter what evidence is produced, there will always be some who credit the historical narrative, and those who dispute it.

Robert Anton Wilson calls this "reality tunnels". We like to tunnel between them.

The issue isn't whether these astronauts went to the moon or not, it's cognitive authority.

Who do you allow to define reality? Whose evidence do you give credence to? If a "debunker" offers a shallow straw-man case and proceeds to shred it with authority arguments, are you likely to accept it?

These ideas are worth exploring, even if they turn out to be garden paths, because it's an opportunity to re-examine assumptions and see how derivative information actually is. Most of us have no idea about these events other than what we've been told. It takes a critical synthesis to form a viewpoint which balances competing narratives to arrive at some semblance of truth.

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